MBP “water damage” but I never spilled anything. :(

[bruno78]

I bought a new MBP in December 2018.

From Day 1 I got it, the usb-c ports on the right side never worked. I had a lot of work to do at that time and really needed my new computer, so it wasn’t possible for me to send it for servicing. The usb ports on the left side were working so I always plugged my devices there. As the MBP was usable, I thought to myself, “Ok I have 1 year to get the fix, so no problem…” .

In the meantime, the MBP developed other problems: some keys were intermittently sticking (there is a recall for this) so I also thought “ok no problem for this”, they’ll fix it too." Also the trackpad doesn’t click anymore since a month.

Back to now. Two days ago I left my MBP to a third-party authorized service center. They called me back saying that all the water damage sensors were triggered, that there were corrosion spots all over the place, mostly near the defective USB ports (and that the water damage caused the problem) and also near the trackpad. Since the warranty is now void because of “water damage”, it would cost me roughly 1000$CAN to replace the logic board and the keyboard.

My main concerns are:
-The usb ports never worked from day 1. So this cannot be related to the “water spill” they refer to. Unless there was already a problem when I got it from Apple, which appear to me almost unbelievable.

-I never spilled anything on my Macbook. And since ALL the sensors were triggered, I guess they imply it would need a major water spill to do that…

Obviously, I refused to repair it now as the macbook is working alright except for the defective USB ports, the unclickable trackpad and a few sticky keys intermittently.

What would be your advices on my case? Any similar case/resolution?
Since there is corrosion and water damages sensors triggered (If I believe the tech, and I don’t see why I should not trust him), I don’t see how I can win my case by calling Apple Customer Support.

I was thinking bringing my computer to an unauthorized repair service center. They would probably be able to clean the logic board and find a solution for way less money. My local non-official service place do a “water spill” cleaning for 90$CAN. And they could give me an experimented opinion on my case since they repair apple products for a living…

Should I trust Apple?

THANK YOU !

 

[chscag]

Welcome to our forums.

Water damage/corrosion can also be caused by humidity and or rapid temperature changes (hot to cold and vice versa).

Your IP address shows as Montreal, Quebec Province. If that is true, could temperature changes or cold - humidity have affected your MacBook Pro? Also, it is possible that the machine was sold to you that way since you mentioned the USB ports on the right side were not working.

By not taking the machine back to Apple right away might be costly. Too late to worry about that now, and I can tell you from other situations that we have had brought to our attention in these forums, that Apple will not relent on repairing the machine unless you pay for it. You can of course appeal to Apple all the way up to Apple Hq, Canada, but it might be like Don Quixote battling Windmills.

I was thinking bringing my computer to an unauthorized repair service center. They would probably be able to clean the logic board and find a solution for way less money. My local non-official service place do a “water spill” cleaning for 90$CAN. And they could give me an experimented opinion on my case since they repair apple products for a living…

That might be your best bet. Sorry that you have to go through all this after spending $$$ on an Apple MacBook Pro which should have worked right on day one.

Let us know how it all turns out.

 

[pigoo3]

From Day 1 I got it, the usb-c ports on the right side never worked.

Back to now. Two days ago I left my MBP to a third-party authorized service center.

What would be your advices on my case?

I know you said you were busy at the time the computer was purchased & really needed the new computer. But honestly...when you purchase a brand expensive item like this...it should work 100% right out of the box. The computer should have been returned or looked at ASAP as soon as something was discovered not working.

As Admin chscag mentioned...if this computer has never experienced a liquid spill...and the liquid sensors have changed color...then pretty much the only explanations for this are high humidity (such as in tropical geographies)...or the computer was in a "steamy" environment for a long enough time to trigger the sensors (such as a steamy kitchen or sauna).

- Nick

 

[bruno78]

Yes you are all right, I should have taken care of the problem right away. I was in a rush and in my mind it was clear that I had 1 full year to get the problem fixed... I guess that's a lesson I'll earn the hard way
And about the high humidity causing the water damage, I really don't see how it could have happened, the few times the macbook got out of the house it was in a padded laptop bag. Inside my house there is no extreme conditions. I live in Montreal, so no tropical weather

There is another thing I didn't mentioned as at first I thought it was only a software problem: Also from the beginning, I experienced frequent crashes, almost every time I logged out of a session and put into sleeping mode. With time, it happened really less frequently, but now since the macbook got out of the repair center, it happen as often as when it was new. My question is, there might exist reports of the crashes dating back to when the computer was new? When I go to the crash reports folder, there are only the reports from the last month, nothing before. Do the computer delete old reports automatically, is there a way to retrieve them? And if so, could this be a proof of my claims to Apple? But to be honest, my expectations are really low


thanks

 

[chscag]

Old crash reports are overwritten as time goes by and when new crashes occur so there really is no way to access them. As I stated above, you can try to elevate your problems with the MacBook Pro with Apple all the way to the top in Canada but it will very likely be in vain.

Get your machine repaired by a reliable repair shop that is experienced with Apple products and chalk all this up to bad luck and lessons learned. One member living in Canada has had very good results with an independent repair shop in Toronto. I know that is distant from you but I will try to find out where it is and if you can perhaps mail the machine to them.

Or, if you know of a local shop that can do the work, that would even be better. Be sure to get a cost estimate of repairs first.

 

[pigoo3]

Yes you are all right, I should have taken care of the problem right away. I was in a rush and in my mind it was clear that I had 1 full year to get the problem fixed... I guess that's a lesson I'll earn the hard way

Trust me...totally understand your logic regarding having 12 months to get the USB port issue looked at. Sounds like the whole water damage/liquid sensors tripped was totally unexpected.

Only other condition I can think of that might trip the H2O sensors if it was exposed to rain (just one time could do it).

Please keep us up-to-date how things progress.

- Nick

 

[bruno78]

Old crash reports are overwritten as time goes by and when new crashes occur so there really is no way to access them. As I stated above, you can try to elevate your problems with the MacBook Pro with Apple all the way to the top in Canada but it will very likely be in vain.

Get your machine repaired by a reliable repair shop that is experienced with Apple products and chalk all this up to bad luck and lessons learned. One member living in Canada has had very good results with an independent repair shop in Toronto. I know that is distant from you but I will try to find out where it is and if you can perhaps mail the machine to them.

Or, if you know of a local shop that can do the work, that would even be better. Be sure to get a cost estimate of repairs first.

I'm living in Montreal and there is a local apple repair shop that seems competent. There is an engineer there that repair logic boards. They claim to have invested 25k $ in equipment in order to be able to do that kind of work.

And because they are independent, I will have an honest opinion on my case and the actual damages on my macbook. But first, I took an appointment at the Genius Bar on saturday to see what they're gonna tell me when I'll ask tons of precise questions.

I'll let you know.
Thx

 

[bruno78]

Trust me...totally understand your logic regarding having 12 months to get the USB port issue looked at. Sounds like the whole water damage/liquid sensors tripped was totally unexpected.

Only other condition I can think of that might trip the H2O sensors if it was exposed to rain (just one time could do it).

Please keep us up-to-date how things progress.

- Nick

Obviously no rain too... when I bring it outside of the house, it's always in a padded laptop bag.

 

[pigoo3]

Obviously no rain too... when I bring it outside of the house, it's always in a padded laptop bag.

Something had to happen regarding moisture...those sensors don't just go off by themselves...especially when there's multiple of them (not just one). Possibly something that was a one-time occurrence that went unnoticed must have happened.

- Nick

 

[bruno78]

Something had to happen regarding moisture...those sensors don't just go off by themselves...especially when there's multiple of them (not just one). Possibly something that was a one-time occurrence that went unnoticed must have happened.

- Nick

Yes I understand, probably something happened related with humidity/weather. But if so, that mean the machine is pretty weak, I mean I'm not living in the Amazonian forest .

But what bug me the most is when the Apple technician tell me that my problems are related to the corrosion /water damage, when I know the problems were present from Day 1.

 

[pigoo3]

But first, I took an appointment at the Genius Bar on saturday to see what they're gonna tell me when I'll ask tons of precise questions.

No need to ask a ton of precise questions. When Apple looks at it...and they see the moisture sensors are tripped...Apple's going to say you need a replacement logic board...this is the way it works. No amount of "precise questions" will make any difference.

On the positive side (from what I'm reading)...this MacBook Pro purchased in December 2018 is just as operational now as it was in December 2018. Thus you've been using it successfully for 11 months. If you've been using this computer successfully for 11 months...very possible you could continue using it as it is (without spending big-money for a replacement logic board).

If the independent repair shop can do something positive (and not make things worse)...for a small amount of cash...then maybe this is worth trying. Otherwise...maybe just better to leave things be...and use it as it's been used for the past 11 months.

- Nick

 

[pigoo3]

...when I know the problems were present from Day 1.

Unfortunately we both know the answer to this!

- Nick

 

[bruno78]

No need to ask a ton of precise questions. When Apple looks at it...and they see the moisture sensors are tripped...Apple's going to say you need a replacement logic board...this is the way it works. No amount of "precise questions" will make any difference.

On the positive side (from what I'm reading)...this MacBook Pro purchased in December 2018 is just as operational now as it was in December 2018. Thus you've been using it successfully for 11 months. If you've been using this computer successfully for 11 months...very possible you could continue using it as it is (without spending big-money for a replacement logic board).

If the independent repair shop can do something positive (and not make things worse)...for a small amount of cash...then maybe this is worth trying. Otherwise...maybe just better to leave things be...and use it as it's been used for the past 11 months.

- Nick

My main arguments to get the repair done are:
-Avoiding the spreading of the corrosion so things don't get worse
-Have the usb ports on the right working properly.

To me the most important is obviously poin t#1. I don't want it to get worse in the next years. I'm not an expert so I don't have an idea of how exactly corrosion will evolve/spread

thx

 

[techiesteve]

My main arguments to get the repair done are:
-Avoiding the spreading of the corrosion so things don't get worse
-Have the usb ports on the right working properly.

To me the most important is obviously poin t#1. I don't want it to get worse in the next years. I'm not an expert so I don't have an idea of how exactly corrosion will evolve/spread

thx

The powdery green and white 'corrosion' I regularly see on liquid damaged logic boards shouldn't spread unless the PCB is still wet, but it can damage the circuitry under it. The 4 TB3 touch bar MacBook Pro's have sockets separate from the logic board, Apple calls then I/O boards. When the base is off it is easy to use a T3 screwdriver to undo the 2 screws holding the I/O board down, then flip up the connector. You can then attach a spare I/O board and connect a USB-C power connector. If it 'dings' you have power, then connect a USB-C drive, or an adapter and a USB3 drive to check the ports are functioning. Then repeat on the other socket. If the replacement I/O board fixes the problem you will have some serious dismantling to do to replace it. If it doesn't fix the problem you will require a logic board replacement. It's quite simple to diagnose. This test goes for both the 13" and 15" 4 TB3 port models. The same I/O board can be fitted to the left or right. The 13" MacBook Pro with just 2 TB3 ports doesn't use an I/O board, any power or data problems with them will require a logic board.

 

[pigoo3]

My main arguments to get the repair done are:
-Avoiding the spreading of the corrosion so things don't get worse
-Have the usb ports on the right working properly.

To me the most important is obviously point#1. I don't want it to get worse in the next years. I'm not an expert so I don't have an idea of how exactly corrosion will evolve/spread

thx

As to point #1 (corrosion): The corrosion won't really spread. It's not like rust on an automobile that spreads. Automobiles are constantly bombarded with water, salt, and other fluids that continuously "feed" the corrosion process (once bare metal is exposed to the elements).

The logic board is primarily made of fiberglass & the connection pathways are usually copper. There really isn't a lot of material there to corrode...and...the corrosion process is not being "fed" by a constant supply of liquid (like water) and salts.

As to point #2 (get the non-working USB ports working). Sure this is a great reason...but is it worth $1000 CDN after you've been using it this way for 11 months.

If this independent repair shop can clean things for a fair price...not do more harm than good in the process...and this will make you feel better...then go for it. $1000 CDN for a replacement logic board to get the non-working USB ports operational doesn't seem worth it to me (especially after it's been used this way for 11 months).

If this were my computer (which of course it isn't)...I would just let things be (unless by some miracle you can convince Apple to replace the logic board for free...or possibly negotiate a greatly reduced cost). With the years of experience I've had with this exact situation...when the Apple techs see tripped moisture sensors...they're going to say "replacement logic board"...and you pay the full cost.

- Nick

 

[bruno78]

As to point #1 (corrosion): The corrosion won't really spread. It's not like rust on an automobile that spreads. Automobiles are constantly bombarded with water, salt, and other fluids that continuously "feed" the corrosion process (once bare metal is exposed to the elements).

The logic board is primarily made of fiberglass & the connection pathways are usually copper. There really isn't a lot of material there to corrode...and...the corrosion process is not being "fed" by a constant supply of liquid (like water) and salts.

As to point #2 (get the non-working USB ports working). Sure this is a great reason...but is it worth $1000 CDN after you've been using it this way for 11 months.

If this independent repair shop can clean things for a fair price...not do more harm than good in the process...and this will make you feel better...then go for it. $1000 CDN for a replacement logic board to get the non-working USB ports operational doesn't seem worth it to me (especially after it's been used this way for 11 months).

If this were my computer (which of course it isn't)...I would just let things be (unless by some miracle you can convince Apple to replace the logic board for free...or possibly negotiate a greatly reduced cost). With the years of experience I've had with this exact situation...when the Apple techs see tripped moisture sensors...they're going to say "replacement logic board"...and you pay the full cost.

- Nick

Thanks for the opinion. I'm thinking the same as you, I won't pay 1000$ just to get back the faulty usb ports. My priority is to get things clean and avoid it get worse...

Another thing to consider is that if in the future I have problems with the keyboard (there is a recall right now), they won't fix it free of charge until the logic board is replaced.

And the independent place do a liquid spill cleaning for 89$CAN. That seems like a good price. At the same time they'll see if there is more important problems in my machine...

thx

- - - Updated - - -

The powdery green and white 'corrosion' I regularly see on liquid damaged logic boards shouldn't spread unless the PCB is still wet, but it can damage the circuitry under it. The 4 TB3 touch bar MacBook Pro's have sockets separate from the logic board, Apple calls then I/O boards. When the base is off it is easy to use a T3 screwdriver to undo the 2 screws holding the I/O board down, then flip up the connector. You can then attach a spare I/O board and connect a USB-C power connector. If it 'dings' you have power, then connect a USB-C drive, or an adapter and a USB3 drive to check the ports are functioning. Then repeat on the other socket. If the replacement I/O board fixes the problem you will have some serious dismantling to do to replace it. If it doesn't fix the problem you will require a logic board replacement. It's quite simple to diagnose. This test goes for both the 13" and 15" 4 TB3 port models. The same I/O board can be fitted to the left or right. The 13" MacBook Pro with just 2 TB3 ports doesn't use an I/O board, any power or data problems with them will require a logic board.

Thanks for all that valuable information !