Odd mouse behavior

[MikeFromMesa]

I have a Mac Mini running Sierra (10.12.6) and I have been using an Apple trackpad (the old model) with the Mini. My trackpad sits about 3 feet from the Mini and is separated by the cabinet wall that houses the Mini. For some time the trackpad has occasionally stopped working. That is, I would move my finger around on the trackpad and nothing would happen on the computer. Sometimes it was because the trackpad had lost contact with the computer (and I tried replacing batteries, but to no effect) and sometimes the trackpad was still connected, but not working. I got a bit tired of the problem and decided to switch to a mouse, at least for a while.

I have a couple of old mice, one a bluetooth and the other a wifi mouse, neither an Apple Magic Mouse. I connected the wifi dongle that came with the wifi mouse to a usb hub and placed the hub so that the mouse could easily talk to the wifi dongle, hoping that would solve the problem. It did not. Now the mouse sometimes works properly, but sometimes when I move the mouse either nothing happens on the monitor or the mouse cursor moves very slowly and then suddenly jumps far ahead so it is very difficult to position the mouse properly. I have modified the mouse properties, but that has not had any affect.

I have switched back and forth between the two mice, wifi and bluetooth, and that seems to solve the problem for a short time and then the newly attached mouse starts acting like the previous mouse - slow or no motion, and then a sudden and large move across the monitor screen.

I have thought about just getting a Magic Mouse, but I have no reason to believe that will solve the problem since I do not know what the problem really is. My bluetooth keyboard works properly so it is hard for me to believe that there is anything wrong with the bluetooth on the Mini. I am about ready to contact Apple Care (I think the Mini is still covered) but thought I would check here first.

 

[bbnck]

Just to be clear, is it both the Bluetooth and USB mouse that start acting up after a while?

A few ideas as to what might be causing this:

• What surface are the mice being used on? If it's a glass or shiny surface, most mice will not track reliably or at all. Also, have you tried connecting a wired USB mouse?
• Consider possible interference from wireless devices. Are there any wireless devices (such as routers) very close to your Mac mini? Do you have a speaker or other device mounted on top of, or close to, the Mac mini? Also, if your wireless USB mouse uses a 2.4 GHz adapter, interference on this band is quite common.
• What about software? The symptoms you describe could also be caused by an application that's utilising excessive resources. This might offer an alternative explanation as to why both mice perform equally unreliably after a certain period of time. Have you noticed any performance issues with your Mac recently?

 

[MikeFromMesa]

Just to be clear, is it both the Bluetooth and USB mouse that start acting up after a while?

A few ideas as to what might be causing this:

• What surface are the mice being used on? If it's a glass or shiny surface, most mice will not track reliably or at all. Also, have you tried connecting a wired USB mouse?
• Consider possible interference from wireless devices. Are there any wireless devices (such as routers) very close to your Mac mini? Do you have a speaker or other device mounted on top of, or close to, the Mac mini? Also, if your wireless USB mouse uses a 2.4 GHz adapter, interference on this band is quite common.
• What about software? The symptoms you describe could also be caused by an application that's utilising excessive resources. This might offer an alternative explanation as to why both mice perform equally unreliably after a certain period of time. Have you noticed any performance issues with your Mac recently?

> What surface are the mice being used on?

It is being used on a new mousepad. I have tried it on several other surfaces as well - a smooth table top, a wool blanket and the sleeve for a kindle. It acts the same way on all such devices.

> Also, have you tried connecting a wired USB mouse?

No, although that is the step I planned to try next. I did not want to use a wired mouse because the setup is not at my desk. I actually sit length-wise on a sofa with a small cabinet at the end. The cabinet contains the Mini and all of the equipment except the usb hub which, for better communications, sits on top of the cabinet.

I have this somewhat strange setup because I sat at a desk for 25 years doing software development and analysis and, after I retired, I did not want to sit at a desk again. Instead I have a small laptop desk which holds the keyboard and the mouse/trackpad. The problem with a wired mouse is that I will then have a wire stretched across the sofa and getting stuck over and under the cushions and my legs. Still, as I mentioned, that is the next step, if only to test and get another point of data.

> Are there any wireless devices (such as routers) very close to your Mac mini?

Hmmm. My router is in the other room (where the desk is) but I do have some other wireless devices in the living room. The TV, my smart phone, a smart dvd player and a couple of other devices. I would not think they would cause a problem, but then I do not really know. I see the problem with the TV on or off, but I need to check to see if the problem recurs when the smart phone is not close.

> Do you have a speaker or other device mounted on top of, or close to, the Mac mini?

Nothing that is actually being used. There are some speakers, but they are not connected to anything.

> if your wireless USB mouse uses a 2.4 GHz adapter, interference on this band is quite common.

I suppose that is a problem as one of my wireless networks is on 2.4GHz but my Mini is on the 5.0GHz network.

> The symptoms you describe could also be caused by an application that's utilising excessive resources

This is one of the things I checked before I posted, but this happens when no other consumer app is being used and I have no heavy cpu usage being indicated. Of course the OS may be doing stuff, but there is nothing I can see that might be causing this.

> Have you noticed any performance issues with your Mac recently?

Yes, and this (mouse problem) did not happen before my upgrade to Sierra, but I do not know if that is coincidental or causative. And, if causative, I do not know if the performance issues are causing the mouse problems or if both problem are being cause by some other problem.

The mouse problems show themselves in some odd and unusual behavior. Not only does the mouse act as I mentioned, but sometimes I can pick the mouse up off the mousepad, put it back down and the problem goes away for a while. Sometimes not. Sometimes I shake the mouse and the problem disappears for a while, sometimes not. Usually if I turn the mouse off and turn on another mouse the new mouse works properly for a couple of minutes until it, too, starts to have issues.

I will check to see if I still have a wired mouse that I can use. Most of my mice are very old and I am not sure I have a wired mouse that will connect to the Mini. I had thought of buying a Magic Mouse, and I would if I had some assurance that it would solve this problem, but I do not know if an Apple mouse will work any better on my system than my current (MacNally, Logitech and Technet) mice.

 

[bbnck]

I will check to see if I still have a wired mouse that I can use. Most of my mice are very old and I am not sure I have a wired mouse that will connect to the Mini. I had thought of buying a Magic Mouse, and I would if I had some assurance that it would solve this problem, but I do not know if an Apple mouse will work any better on my system than my current (MacNally, Logitech and Technet) mice.

I couldn't really advise with any kind of confidence as to whether using an Apple Magic Mouse will solve your problem. There are countless reasons why you could be experiencing this issue, so right now the best thing you can do is test and eliminate the obvious possible causes. Let us know how it goes.

Hopefully others here may have some alternative suggestions that might be helpful.

 

[MikeFromMesa]

I couldn't really advise with any kind of confidence as to whether using an Apple Magic Mouse will solve your problem. There are countless reasons why you could be experiencing this issue, so right now the best thing you can do is test and eliminate the obvious possible causes. Let us know how it goes.

Hopefully others here may have some alternative suggestions that might be helpful.

I checked my wired mice and they all are old enough that they do not have a usb connector, so I have no way to test them. I could order a new wired mouse as it would be relatively inexpensive and I may do that.

I have three wireless mice and they all exhibit the same strange behavior which implies to me that either they are so old that they do not work well in the Mini or that the problem is the Mini itself.

My trackpad, although it also acts strangely, is more dependable than the mice so I have returned to it, at least for the moment. I am reluctant to spend $70 for a Magic Mouse as I have no reason to believe that it will work any better than my present wireless mice. Perhaps I just need to learn to live with this problem.

Thank you for the attempt to help. You did give me the thought of getting a wired mouse to see if that solves the problem.

 

[MacInWin]

Here is a test, costs nothing to perform. Move the Mini to the outside of the cabinet (maybe sitting on top?) and see if the problem goes away. If it does, the issue is the signal strength between mouse and mini being degraded by the cabinet. If it does NOT go away, the cabinet is eliminated as the issue.

 

[MikeFromMesa]

Here is a test, costs nothing to perform. Move the Mini to the outside of the cabinet (maybe sitting on top?) and see if the problem goes away. If it does, the issue is the signal strength between mouse and mini being degraded by the cabinet. If it does NOT go away, the cabinet is eliminated as the issue.

That is a very interesting idea but not practical in this case as all of the connecting devices, and the power supply wires, are also in the cabinet and connected via wires that snake out the back and around partitions. I would have to disassemble the whole system to be able to move the Mini ti the of the cabinet.

However, I can probably do the equivalent by turning the monitors around and sitting on the floor on the open side of the cabinet. That would put the lap desk and mice in a direct line with the Mini and give me some idea if the bluetooth signal strength is the issue. Thanks for giving me the idea.

 

[MacInWin]

That should work. The idea is to eliminate, if you can, the cabinet as a contributor to the issue.

 

[MikeFromMesa]

That should work. The idea is to eliminate, if you can, the cabinet as a contributor to the issue.

Two things:

First, I ran the experiment. I turned the monitor around and moved to the other side, but still had the same mouse problem, so it must not be the bluetooth signal strength. I do not have this problem with my bluetooth keyboard at all, but then I can not be sure how sensitive the BT receivers in the mice might be.

What I found more interesting is the wired mice. As I mentioned, all of my wired mice are PS2 mice, not usb, and who still has any PS2 to usb adapters around? Well, as it turned out, I do. I was going through some drawers with old computer hardware looking for something else and came across an old PS2 to usb connector for both keyboard and mouse. When I connected the mouse to it I found that the it worked and I have not (yet) seen the same problem. The mouse is probably 15 years old, but it is working.

 

[bbnck]

I know this will be very inconvenient for you to do but I would advise trying your Mac mini in another room with your Bluetooth and wireless mouse. This will help eliminate electromagnetic interference as one of the possible causes.

 

[MikeFromMesa]

I know this will be very inconvenient for you to do but I would advise trying your Mac mini in another room with your Bluetooth and wireless mouse. This will help eliminate electromagnetic interference as one of the possible causes.

Are there interior devices that might cause electromagnetic interference? If so, what might they be. Perhaps it would be easier to turn those things off and then test as moving the computer and wiring would be a really difficult. It would mean disassembling the whole setup, moving it all and then reassembling it after the test. If the interference was from outside then there might not be any other choice.

Interestingly enough the wired mouse has not shown this problem at all and I decided to take the chance and order a new Apple Compatible wireless mouse to see if it also has this problem. If not, then it must be the old mice. If so, then I will have to decide whether to continue using the wired mouse or to move all of the equipment.

Thanks for the suggestion.

 

[MikeFromMesa]

Problem solved (I think)

I believe that I have found the problem, or at least one of them.

I have tried both bluetooth and wifi mice, trying to get something to work. When I connected the wifi mouse I put the mouse transmitter in one of the connections of a usb hub since I am out of usb connections on my Mini. Yesterday, when the new wifi mouse came in, I did the same with its transmitter (I assume they are all the same since they all are 2.4GHz) and got absolutely no response. None. Not even it working for a short time and then quitting. I assumed I got a bad mouse and prepared to return it.

I had removed the PS2 connector for the wired mouse to allow me to test the wifi mouse alone and, since nothing else was plugged into the usb hub, I actually removed it from the usb extension cable and plugged the wifi transmitter into the cable directly. That fixed the issue. The wifi mouse, which did not work at all, now seems to be working properly. I will also test the other wifi mice that worked intermittently with their transmitter plugged directly into the usb extension cable but feel reasonably confident that they will work as well.

I am guessing that something in the priority scheduling of the usb hub was preventing the wifi mouse from operating properly. Much of the time there was nothing else plugged into the hub, but disconnecting it from the system seems to have solved the problem for this wifi mouse. There is still the problem as to why the bluetooth mouse did not work either, but this seems to be working now.

I wanted to thank you for all of the time you took in trying to solve this issue.

 

[MacInWin]

I am guessing that something in the priority scheduling of the usb hub was preventing the wifi mouse from operating properly. Much of the time there was nothing else plugged into the hub, but disconnecting it from the system seems to have solved the problem for this wifi mouse. There is still the problem as to why the bluetooth mouse did not work either, but this seems to be working now.

More likely it was a power issue. Hubs, unless separately powered, don't seem to carry the power from the USB port to the device well, in my experience. Even powered hubs are less optimal than a direct connection.

But is the mouse WiFi or Bluetooth? And why not connect directly to the Mini instead of through a dongle?

 

[MikeFromMesa]

More likely it was a power issue. Hubs, unless separately powered, don't seem to carry the power from the USB port to the device well, in my experience. Even powered hubs are less optimal than a direct connection.

But is the mouse WiFi or Bluetooth? And why not connect directly to the Mini instead of through a dongle?

This particular hub was not powered. It might be worth testing a powered hub, just out of curiosity.

I tried 3 mice, two of which were wifi and one of which was bluetooth. They all exhibited similar problems and I made the (apparently mistaken) assumption that the source of all of the problems was the same and that if I could fix one, it would also fix the others. That is true of the wifi mice as they now all are working properly.

As to why I used the hub, the answer is simple. I had run out of usb ports on the Mini.

There are only 4 usb ports on the Mini and they were taken up by an external work disk (solid state drive used to expand the effective memory of the Mini), a Time Machine drive (I had this set up as a network drive but had problems with Time Machine corrupting the backup. I was advised to use a usb connect instead) and an external drive for the storage of my digital photos. Because I had only one more usb port I attached the hub for any extra drives, flash memory and the like that I needed to use from time to time. That is where I put the wifi transmitter, and that apparently was the core of the problem.

I have "re-wired" the Mini to use the usb hub as the central port for 2 of my drives, connected the Monitor upstream line to give me access to the usb hub on the Monitor and plan to put the wifi transmitter directly into the Mini instead of hanging at the end of an extension.